Wind Power: Damning With Faint Praise.

Jonathan Porritt (Yes! ’Tis He!) takes on that Simon Jenkins article decrying wind power as ugly and more expensive than wind.

Jenkins claims that wind
will require "dedicated backup", but this is not the case – and our
view is supported by the National Grid, which runs the electricity
system. Dedicated backup is not required for wind because backup
supplies are provided for the whole electricity system, not for each
individual plant. If this weren’t the case, we’d need backup for every
plant in the UK: nuclear and coal also have unplanned shutdowns, and
when they do the effect is more dramatic than for wind.

Well, yes, but nuclear and coal do not have shutdowns 70% of the time so clearly wind power requires more back up than the other systems.

Of course, all generating
plants use energy in their manufacture and construction, but wind is
one of the lowest on the basis of carbon per unit of power delivered.

As, indeed, is nuclear.

Finally, Jenkins claims
that cost for wind adds up to double that of the most expensive nuclear
power. But it’s impossible to make an accurate cost comparison with
nuclear, as no nuclear plants have been built in Europe for over a
decade. The subsidies wind power receives are small by nuclear
standards, but they have already resulted in dramatic cost reductions.
Indeed, as fossil fuel prices increase and wind turbines become cheaper
to build, wind power is likely to become one of the cheapest forms of
electricity generation over the next 15 years.

Riiiight. So you’re comparing the latest and most up to date wind technologies with nuclear at least two decades (given the time it takes to build) out of date? There’s intellectual purity for you. The actual report on the subsidies required for nuclear v wind was done by Oxera and they pointed out that the requirements were three times larger for wind than nuclear. That means larger, not smaller. Finally, "as fossil fuel prices increase"? Who says so? Got some crystal ball telling you what the oil price is going to be in a decade or two? Really? And, err, rising fossil fuel prices, if they do actually occur, work just as much to nuclear’s advantage as they do to wind.

Wind power, both on- and
offshore, must be part of this mix, and has the potential to supply the
UK with 20% or more of our electricity – emission free and at low risk.

Emission free eh? Not what you said above:

Of course, all generating
plants use energy in their manufacture and construction, but wind is
one of the lowest on the basis of carbon per unit of power delivered.

That just ain’t emission free now is it?

Now I know that this is the sub-editor speaking, not Porritt, but:

Wind power is reliable and could soon prove to be cheaper than nuclear, says Jonathon Porritt

So we agree at the moment that it isn’t cheaper than nuclear?

4 responses

  1. You know, and I know, that when one speaks of “emission free” one means something that produces no emissions in operation. You know, and I know, that last year (or was it the year before?) the government handed the nuclear industry a flat gift of forty-eight billion quid by taking over all the decommissioning and waste management liabilities. You know, and I know, that this has strangely failed to alter the calculations of nuclear advocates: Mr. Jenkins didn’t even trouble to mention it.
    I would also point out that backup is backup. Once provided, it backs up anything. As there is no single point of failure between coal-fired, nuclear, and wind generation, I don’t see much reason to duplicate the backup.
    Also, the Bernard Ingham crowd like to pretend that this back-up is provided by coal fired stations that require 24 hours’ notice for steam and hence must be kept running. It is not, it is provided by gas turbines. At Ferrybridge in Yorkshire these are or were Rolls Royce Olympus units, the same engines used in RAF V-bombers that were kept on three-minute Quick Reaction Alert throughout the cold war without finding it necessary to run their engines continuously. I smell bullshit.
    I’m sure you are also aware of the difference between an unplanned shutdown and intermittency. Wind intermittency is included in the measurement of a turbine’s efficiency and is hence incorporated in planning assumptions.
    But for some reason, I can accept these things and you can’t. I cannot begin to understand the weird ideological loathing the Right has for wind power. It is as if every turbine was a vote for socialism. How did a religious belief in nuclear power become so important for conservatives? I cannot work it out – a centralising, plan-led technology that throughout its history has been subsidised and led by the State, and was championed in Britain by none other than Tony Benn? Presumably it is simple Thatcher-worship.
    I have no basic dispute with nuclea r power. I would simply point out that any new build will simply run out of uranium in pointlessly short order unless it is composed exclusively of fast breeders. And if we are going to do anything with nuclear, it should be to displace fossil fuel generation rather than to further an ideological war against renewables.
    Tim adds: Not sure I count as a Conservative or even a conservative but anyway. Me? I’m much more interested in fuel cells as widespread adoption would make me a very rich person. But my opposition to wind is twofold. It gets up the noses of all the right people and, from all the reports I’ve seen, is more expensive than nuclear.
    I actually read Porritt-s report on wind power this morning and yes, I was enlightened in some ways. One way being that he thinks wind will be cost competetive without subsidy in 2020 (but still including carbon tax considerations…the externalities etc). Which to my mind means that we start building them in 2020.

  2. Agammamon Avatar
    Agammamon

    Its not that we have a loathing for wind-power per se, but that we have a loathing for failing to face the facts.
    While nukes have the potential to be devestating to the environment, our history with them shows that they’re actually pretty safe and WCS just don’t happen.
    Wind-power on the other hand is a constant low level environmental destroyer. They have to be put in areas with a lot of wind, which also tend to be in wilderness/delicate environmental areas – construction techniques are pretty advanced, but you’ve still got to build permanent roads for servicing. They smash up the birdies, and they destroy scenic views.
    One day wind-power may cheap and efficient enough to mitigate these costs, and on that day we on the “right” will be jumping on the wind bandwagon as fast as we can.
    Until then I’m pro-nuke and proud of it.

  3. dearieme Avatar
    dearieme

    “I would also point out that backup is backup. Once provided, it backs up anything.” That’s a strangely unquantitative argument. Is it really the case that devices prone to “intermittency” need no more back-up? Why then has much effort been spent on trying to make conventional power stations (and conventional all-sorts-of-things) more reliable?

  4. Because having fewer failures is good. But there is absolutely no reason to assume that conventional or nuclear’s outages will be correlated with the weather – the only scenario where you’d need to back up both fleets.
    If we need enough extra gas turbine capacity to cover the entire wind generation capacity going offline simultaneously, then this capacity also displaces the same amount of back-up for the existing stations (and vice versa) unless you think the conventional plants are as likely to go down as the wind turbines…and if you think that your argument just went missing.
    If we’re already backing up the stuff that’s meant to be so much more reliable, then by definition it (the backup) will be available for all the times the less reliable stuff is down.

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